7th Pre-Release Ready

[captain kilvo]

Hi everyone. I have been using latest pre release XL for a month now after spending a long time looking for a frontend that I like. I am a home DIY user finally completing a whole house AV system with Video and Audio streamed from home built master servers to 8 rooms. Everything, including lighting and security cameras cotrolled by Pronto TSU9600's (Yep it all finally works after many problems) Watching the posts in the forum I am concerned that there is a possibility that the pre release version will eventually go "pop" and an end user software only option will not be available. The conception that marketing XL as part of a total package solution only to installers to ensure repeat orders is comercially incorrect. It may well be in the short term, however in the long term the market for DIY home automation will develop rapidly in the coming years. If MS had only marketed is operating systems to total package purchasers virtually all home PCs would be running on Linux or other operating systems. Take a look at the major DIY companies. The success of any product is governed by its inherent qualities and value for money and a solid product will sell to both commercial installers and end users. XL is a great product and I believe demand from the DIY end user market would soon overtake demand from the custom installer sector. I for one sincerely hope that a software only option will be made available at a price that will be within reach of the masses.

Best of luck with XL to all concerned

[Vaporware]

If we sold a 1000 copies at $ 100.00 each this would not come close to cover the current development costs to date.

I fail to see how is that any worse than selling 10 @ $10.000
.

... killing time..... (tongue in cheek)
Actually this tells us a lot. For starters I doubt that there are currenty 1000 active user on this forum so I would guess the price is going to be over $ 100.00. Lets say 350 active forum users. So if 1000 x $ 100.00 = 100,000.00 which "would not come close to cover the current development costs to date" then 100,000.00 / 350 members = $ 286.00 and it would not cover cost.
Of course just the forum members can not be burdened with the entire cost otherwise it would be $ 250,000.00 (guessing) / 350 members = $ 715.00.. So the price is going to be greater than $ 100.00 and less than $ 750.00.. At least at this point in time as defined by "the current development costs to date".
Yep. Getting the feeling that there will be no 'just software' option and we will have to buy Calrad hardware. Not sure if that is a good or bad thing but it will trash everyones setup that is already here.

[cmhardwick]

Well, considering CQC is $695 for software only system, if they can match functionality (which they can and customization of skins is also a huge selling point) at a lower price point, then I think they would have a winner. Whether they WILL or not remains to be seen. They certainly, from Wes's posts, seem to be concentrating currently on the installer market. I would still love to know what one of those integrated systems runs for!

[cubesys]

one of the nice things about CQC is the level of support for different hardware (for free) and the stability of the system. To me, stability is what seperates the great software from the rest as I am looking to have my htpc work like any piece of electronics in the house.

By the way, any integrator who sells xlobby is welcome to contact me and quote a solution. I have already begun getting other quotes.

Itai

[Vaporware]

By the way, any integrator who sells xlobby is welcome to contact me and quote a solution. I have already begun getting other quotes.

Itai

According to Wes:
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=5979

The reason we have no pricing is to protect over 5,000 + authorized distributors we have, they would stop buying from us if we show this information.

Seems with over 5,000 + authorized distributors you should be able to find an integrator.. You should give Calrad a call so they can hook you up with one in your area..

Tom

[snsumner]

I haven't been a member of this forum for very long and I've only been using Xlobby for about a year now. But, after meeting Wes and Steven at CEDIA and reading much of the discussion on various threads. I would concluded that the business model is not going to continue as software only. That being said I hope to still continue to use Xlobby even though the hardware/software model really doesn't fit my criteria. If I was a integrator selling Xlobby I won't want it floating around the Internet for any price.

[cmhardwick]

However, CQC does just that ... Installer version and DIY version. It can be done.

[P3rv3rt B3ar]

However, CQC does just that ... Installer version and DIY version. It can be done.

Aaah we r back at Veyrons and Folkswagons again... but problem really is that most members of this board wants folkswagon pricetag with veyrons engine...

[cmhardwick]

Sooo, what you're trying to say B3ar, is that we're mostly a bunch of mizerly ol' skinflints?

[P3rv3rt B3ar]

Sooo, what you're trying to say B3ar, is that we're mostly a bunch of mizerly ol' skinflints?

No, what im trying to say its hard dilemma... somehow they need to make sure that installers wont just buy cheap DIY version, and yet not to cripple our version too bad...

How does these installer versions licenses works anyway? surely they cant just spawn new copies for their customers

cause otherwise we board members could just found "xlobby skinflints" installation "company" and share cost of one installer version and ship it around the world

[Vaporware]

Sooo, what you're trying to say B3ar, is that we're mostly a bunch of mizerly ol' skinflints?

Of course that is what he is saying.. Truth hurts..

I am still hoping that Calrad will still offer the forum users here a software deal only which is why I think a lot of us are sticking around waiting for the shoe to drop. Most of us have a lot of time and money in existing hardware just to toss it away unless of course Calrad gives us a great Hardware/Software deal. My gut feeling is that we are most likely not going to get a software or Hardware/Software deal. Why do I feel this way.. Well.. the Xlobby forum support community is drying up fast so therefore Calrad has no incentive to give the rest of us left here any deals. Lets say they offer a software deal for $ 500.00. How many of us left here would take it. Fifty.. Twenty.. ten.. five.. Is it really worth their effort for future support for such a low volume of users when they can easily make up that cost with a few high $$ installs. Down the road Calrad can easily change Xlobby so it only works with their hardware and thus forcing the users that may have gotten just the software only deal to buy their hardware.. I am not saying that will happen I was just speculating on what could happen...
Based upon what snsumner wrote :

But, after meeting Wes and Steven at CEDIA and reading much of the discussion on various threads. I would concluded that the business model is not going to continue as software only.

Basically Calrad is going to catering to the high end which is not what the users are here .. Why did the users come here in the first place.. because Xlobby was free and was a great product... There was also a great amount of friendly helpful forum users with a ton of useful plugins and skins.. Now Xlobby still is great but is going to cost a unknown $$ even if it ever gets sold as software only and the support people are leaving ... Why leaving.. because it is going to cost.. So yes..

we're mostly a bunch of mizerly ol' skinflints

... Truth hurts..

Later,
Tom

[sdumas]

It looks to me as it is almost a tactic to make us go away. We'll get so frustrated that we will be moving to greener pastures and the issue will disappear.
No more Xlobby hobbyists complainers that wants their FreeLobby, no more bickering about a $49 piece of unprofitable software that they can't maintain, no more "could you add this feature for me please since my wife can't stand the way it works now" requests, no more having to disclose too much information about the code so that the community can expand the functionnality without their help... need I add more.

CQC is charging a lot of money for their DIY, but they do allow it - it should be simple. Contractual agreements could make sure that the "Partners" that will derogate from it, could be cut off and be off the list. Since Calrad "have 5,000" such partners, a few xlobbyists like us should not make their big install business go away, right?

As Calrad said, (not the exact quote I regret) "A 1,000 copies of Xlobby at $100 versus a few complete installs with hardware at much more money than that is not profitable. "
Therefore it is very clear to see that "it ain't gonna happen for us", we are the thorn on the side, the danger that lurks and could "spill" the code too widely for free on the net where they could lose to their big installs. We are not a priority. If they delay us enough, we'll all go away by ourselves... It has started, it is just a question of time...

R.I.P. - Xlobbyists, 2002-2007.

[wesblack]

This is not the case, watch the forum over the next 24hrs. We do care about the freeware xLobby users as this is why it has been so difficult for Steven and Calrad to address all the issues and concerns or make any fair decisions and not just simply move on with no regard for everyone here. We beleive we have come up with a reasonable solution for the moment and yes not everyone will be happy.

Stay tuned !





Wes Black \ Calrad

[Jay]

Otherwise, they would have simply shut down this forum. But they did not.

Thanks Wes.

Anxiously awaiting news.

[Vaporware]

Otherwise, they would have simply shut down this forum. But they did not.

Thanks Wes.

Anxiously awaiting news.

Yes, You are correct. I am actually amazed that they have taken so much crap. Even from me. I have been dishing it out lately mostly from the frustration of waiting. They easily could have pulled the plug on the forum or moderated the post but Calrad choose not to go that route. I take my hat off to them for that. If they pulled the plug on the forum that would have generated a fair amount of bad PR. Bad PR is not good for any company. What they have done indicates that they are trying to find a happy medium. That is tough to do..
Especially with this crowd. Hopefully by Saturday morning we will have an answer and it will be a good answer

Tom